Few things mostly 1 thing

[Kaczor]

Hi, old friends and foes I didn't want to make new thread for everything I wanted to say, so I have few suggestions/questions.

I'll keep it short and brief

Give I3d settings please!

on a serious note though could we get I3d nades on this server?
It'd be dream come true
I've been playing ze again roughly 3 weeks now~~ and zombies are really at big disadvantage with no knockback to play around the nades but fire that slows you down... cts using rebuys to hold the zombies as long as they want is also pretty annoying makes you wanna go spec as soon as you're zombie.

Also what are the chances of new zombie skins? or at least a poll for a change.


Thanks

 

[ZeGaWa]

Also what are the chances of new zombie skins? or at least a poll for a change.

https://unloze.com/threads/nomination-thread-for-new-vips-skins.1079/

 

[Kaka]

Do you want i3d nades on all maps? Currently we have failnades with fire on casual maps e.g (atix, licciana, rooftop) and just regular fire nades on harder maps. I'm all for pure knockback nades as long as it stays on casual maps

You have a point with rebuys, i think that system has gotten out of hand actually. Problem is that some maps just require you too use rebuys too beat bosses but i have seen a rebuy inflation system too counter rebuy spam. Which could be a solution

 

[Kaby]

Stopped reading at i3d

 

[ZeGaWa]

i have seen a rebuy inflation system too counter rebuy spam. Which could be a solution

GFL used it, it have good and bad point.
Remember that we have no steam player now. And they struggle dont beat some easy maps even with that kind of settings.
So putting our settings too hard can discourage our new player base.

 

[Kaka]

GFL used it, it have good and bad point.
Remember that we have no steam player now. And they struggle dont beat some easy maps even with that kind of settings.
So putting our settings too hard can discourage our new player base.

The problem for me at least is that only good players utilize this system with using binds etc. So they can make a really major mistake and when you get close too them they start spamming rebuys and usually that is enough too buy them tons of time or too catch up with their teammates

 

[gkuo88]

This cancer again. “Zombies are powerless” opinion has always been a retarded opinion because players never take into consideration the wide scale of maps and their difficulties, the different levels of holds on maps, server situation including the presence of a good team and the presence of a leader, and the most important factor of all, the prefrence and actions of the complainer themselves.

Either way the playerbase will naturally balance itself out. If zombies are too powerless, they will naturally attempt harder maps more often or normal maps without leaders or the perfect team. If zombies are overpowered, they will naturally avoid certain maps or save certain maps for when the right team and leaders come on.

Granting zombies more power will naturally require more work to achieve the same results which players dont naturally put forth. Note that you yourself are an average player, and if a certain amount of power were granted to make you feel significant as a zombie, every single player will recieve that level of power as well while you play as a human. The consequences brought forth may include many more losses as humans before getting that win or the server balancing itself out by not playing the map anymore.

Now you have to ask yourself. Are you willing to go though many more losses as a human in a session that might not even guarentee a win at the end? If you don’t wish to deal with that, you shouldnt expect others to deal with it either. Thus in the end of it all it would be stupid to grant the mechanic as in the end, even giving it to the players, the players ended up playing less than often as they avoided the consequences brought forth by the bullshit they asked for in the first place. The server shifts to an easier set of maps, and the problem repeats all over with the same players complaining once again zombies are too powerless.

 

[ZeGaWa]

The problem for me at least is that only good players utilize this system with using binds etc. So they can make a really major mistake and when you get close too them they start spamming rebuys and usually that is enough too buy them tons of time or too catch up with their teammates

Personally if we remove the rebuy now and don't make it balance enough we will loose even more maps.
And we will play even more the same fucking map everyday because players are lazy/scared/ or whatever about trying new maps. Because on some of them you really need more than just 40% of the team defending instead of doorhugging.

So ok maybe in some case rebuy spamming is not fair but it permit to compensate the gap between the number total of player and the real amount of player who defend against zombies.

 

[Nivinski]

 

[Nanami]

Personally if we remove the rebuy now and don't make it balance enough we will loose even more maps.
And we will play even more the same fucking map everyday because players are lazy/scared/ or whatever about trying new maps. Because on some of them you really need more than just 40% of the team defending instead of doorhugging.

So ok maybe in some case rebuy spamming is not fair but it permit to compensate the gap between the number total of player and the real amount of player who defend against zombies.

That's a good argument ZeGaWa!

 

[Kaka]

Personally if we remove the rebuy now and don't make it balance enough we will loose even more maps.

My intentions wasn't too remove it. Currently rebuying 11 tmps or 6 p90 i dont really see that as a healthy system and needs too be scaled down not removed. It's quite tedious too play even more when you're chasing a guy with 10 smgs in his pocket. You're getting close but he does another rebuy and manages too hold off 3 zms and this process repeats 10 times so in the end this one guy has wasted around 30 seconds for 3 zms.

 

[Glacius Verglas]

I see rebuys as a “pro” -mechanic, and it has never been a problem, nor will it ever be.

 

[Schicksal]

It is simple why people tend to not accept changes because they fear changes. First of all everyone must finally understand that you shouldn’t just play ze for “winning” maps. Of course people get tired and discouraged when they keep failing certain maps, but every one of you miss totally the point what this game mode was once made for. There is a team called “Human team” and there is a team called “Zombie team”. Both of the teams have to teamwork in order to achieve their victory. I agree to half with Kaka. With the current settings you can easily hold off 3zombies alone by just rebuying which he is right with. We are not in 2012-2014 where just a few people used binds for rebuys. In fact this game is in the end status what means that everyone by far is now able to rebuy any gun. If a game becomes old and people already know what to do because they did it 100times already, what will result out of it? People will get tired, the game will become unattractive, and players will come from time to time to play.

But there is a solution for this and it is simple. It is up to us to make some suggestions to get some changes done. To keep the mode fresh, to bring the fun aspect back, they also have to struggle and “deserve” their wins. Sure you can come with the argument of no steam players, but that won’t change anything. Teamwork is the key for this mode and that is why people still enjoy this game because they want to figure out together a strat to achieve victory on a certain map no matter how long it takes to create those, day by day, week by week, month by month. Just winning all maps straight, where would be the fun? Do you think players would want to play those maps again? No, they simply wouldn’t because they were done so fast that Map X is already unattractive for them.

Those players just need a good person that leads, they will listen, they will work together and that’s how it is supposed to be. Like Kaka mentioned you don’t even have to take the rebuys out. But you could simply consider raising the prizes for rebuys, BUT the big BUT now. This depends on which maps you play kaka. On bigger maps like Fapescape Rote, Santassination, Castlevania(maybe just an example) and Frostdrake, you actually would need rebuys a lot. For example you could raise the prizes definitely for old school maps, where you definitely do not need 10 smgs. The same counts for let’s say “middle hard” maps. Sure, at the end this would take a lot of effort to get done. But if you want to keep something fresh and good you will have to work hard for it.

 

[Kaka]

I was quite general with my arguments but i pretty much play all sorts of maps, casual maps too the more extreme ones. My main issue is that since smgs are so quick too deploy you have infinitive ammo until your cash runs dry and thats what i want too reduce. Players should have some sort of power on their own but granting them too much will just be annoying on the receiving end and feels like a cheap game mechanic. I don't see spamming rebuys a pro mechanic if anything it makes players get away with a lot of dumb shit that shouldn't have worked out otherwise. Imo the system rewards spamming rebuys instead of learning too conserve ammo for certain situations kinda when you approach that light hill and have some ammo saved up too stop the bhoping zm's before they gain too much speed.

My own solution too this is too limit things too 3 rebuys on every map so there is a form of consitancy so players can spam rebuys too some extent so even then new guy Bob can change weapons midgame as well and not be too punished by it. On the more extreme cases the only ones that comes too mind is Santa and Fapescape rote i would either suggest reducing the hp through stripper too compensate the nerf instead. There might be more maps on the extreme cases but those are maps i found myself using rebuys on

 

[gkuo88]

Ah great, once again we have this shit with schick as the new backy 2.0 trying to toss the server down the gfl route. Sry schick, but some of the stuff ya said has really pissed me off.

People dont fear changes. The vast majority of the server doesnt come onto the forums and note when changes have been made. What they will note is when playing on the server, is their experience more or less enjoyable than before. And even after that, because they dont know that changes have been implemented, the first thing they end up doing is blaming is their teammates, not the settings. In the end of it all, harder settings means more work, and theres no guarentee that players will put in extra work. Instead players usually don't adapt to the changes and simply find something else more enjoyable.

People need to play not just to win? And how are you going to get people to do that? And what other reasons are they to play for? The vast majority of people who play video games do it to win, and its not something you can dictate. Just like whatever the hell you do to some doorhuggers, whether it be commanding, slapping, or slaying, they will continue doorhugging as you will not have control over them. You can give as many liberal ass speeches you want to, but if players feel as if they arent having a good time, they will simply quit playing, rather than just dealing with the hopeless situation before them.

Where the heck have you been? People have always played the same maps hundreds of times over. According to you, it should be boring and unintresting by now, yet people still keep voting to play those maps. On the other hand I dont see teamwork maps taking up a big majority of the average day, and when it does get played, its usually one very loud person pushing for it. If there is a leader, they may tryhard a bit on it, and if things go to shit fast, they give up quickly. This notion of teamwork is fun is built solely on good sessions with good leadership and a contributing team. OutSide of those situations, teamwork is avoided like the plauge and Im not surprised either. Without a leader or a good team, the only ones who struggle are those who play at their best, but whose efforts are utterly wasted because victory is dependent on the participation of their teammates which they cannot control.

Maybe you should consider why those maps are constantly overplayed even when they are easy and winnable. Those who play are not hindered by their team, there is no need for a leader, or the need for teammates to play well. Considering that leaders and a good team are not regular occurances, its no surprise that those maps which have been won hundreds of times over continue to be constantly played, as players have a higher capability to control their own fate rather than depending on their uncontrollable teammates. You might not consider it fun, intresting, fresh, or enjoyable, but your views do not dictate the views of other players. These easygoing maps make up for the times when the server isnt running in full teamwork mode, so why the heck are you trying to turn them into teamwork dependent maps as well?

All we need is a leader? And who is going to be this leader? Are you planning to lead several hours a day until the server dies out? For your idea to work, there is an expectancy for someone to do the leading, and not just temporarily. If you’re incapable of placing in that effort, you shouldnt expect anyone else to. And if no one does actually put in the work, expect things to get really shitty.

Then again your suggestion is decent, but a change is a change, and you should limit it to several popular maps to see if their popularity increases or decreases over half a year, without artifical interference. In the worst case, you could end up screwing over all easygoing maps, giving players nothing to fall back on.

 

[Kaczor]

I'm liking personal attacks on each other here but my mains issue is having rebuys and fire nades with no knockback at the same time. How long does a fire last anyway like 2 seconds?You do the math you have 2 granades, however many rebuys u want where it's p90's or tmps now imagine 1-5 cts holding crucial spot like the only spot you're able to get humans on the map before some kind of teleport back happens or they're just in the safe zone somwhere having materias or whatever. Now it's like what up to 20 seconds + held just by 5 people. Now like some1 said it's the same people map jumping from server to server Mako, Fxishiters, Paranoid, MINAS so it's mostly them holding the crucial items to cover humans, sometimes you'll get troll here and there with materias but in 2018 you eban faster than he can press E anyway.


Gkuo Idk sounds to me like you're trying to settle down for mediocrity because you think average ze player doesn't like a little bit of challange therefore as soon as things would get slightly harder he'd immediately quit the server. I'm trying to understand your point of view trying to get to the majority of the server not individuals I guess.

I also wanted to add that when I3d beat maps like minas,mako,whatever big map the feeling was much more rewarding than those bg's,pf's,gfl's I agree with Shicksal to certain extent that yes you do need a challange instead of every round being predictable unless the key players that always defend are suddenly mother zombies :)

Anyway what I hope we could see is at least a tryout with no fire nades, or some kind of events with those kind of settings I think that'd be pretty cool but then again it's your server do whatever you want with it I just wanted to spice things up a little bit.

 

[D()G@N]

https://unloze.com/threads/increase-rebuy-prizes.1089/

 

[gkuo88]

No kac, reread my stuff. Players dont usually know when challenge has been implemented. The only information that comes to them is whether or not they win or lose more on the maps they choose to play on. An increase in difficulty that is significant to make zombies feel like they are less powerless will no doubt create an increase in losses as humans. The following questions do not include joke maps, probably because people are used to losing on joke maps and they cant see an increase in losses.

For players who are wishing to play casually, how will they react to an increase in losses? For players who are tryharding? For a doorhugger? For a defender who is already constantly in action?

For a defender who is already gunning as much as they can, how will they place in more effort than before in adaptation to an increase in difficulty?

Are players willing to engage in challenge willing to engage in it on a constant hourly basis, considering the server is usually on for 6 to 10 hours, 7 days a week?

Between winning as a human and winning as a zombie, which do players take priority?

Maps that are that give a more rewarding feeling of winning, why exactly do they give that feeling compared to other maps? And why arent they played more often?

Seriously take a moment to think about those questions.

 

[Schicksal]

Sorry mate to „piss you off“it wasn’t intended (OmegaLUL). Everything you said is fine for me but that is just your point of view. Mine as much as others are different for a reason. I also don’t understand why you put Backys name in here. I do not have any problem with that but making Backy look like “he would have destroyed GFL” with some “minor” changes that people just voted for and don’t have any problems with, is something you shouldn’t really do. You and some others are just simple exaggerating the cases. But like I have always said you can’t please every single player. Neither Backy nor I nor someone else has the intention to “destroy” zombie escape. We just want to give people a good feeling to enjoy the game mode as much as we do and did. With time a game changes like I have mentioned before and you can’t just sit there on your comfortable seat and act like everything would go fine keeping up the same “settings” over and over again. Why do you think people always liked to play on newer servers? It is simple because from passing months or years getting used to different mechanics they are happy to play on servers with way different mechanics.

But we aint being in GFL here homie. This is Unloze playground and things work way different in this hood. Jokes aside. I will try to make you understand what I am really talking about. If you wanna argue go ahead I do not have any problem with that.

Your first “point of view” is according to you that people “do not fear changes” and do not come online to the forums…. Sorry mate but you are wrong here. I tell you something, there are many people that care as much as we do about the server. The same counts to GFL players and I will use parallels to it. It is all just about the point of view people have. You say that but looking on the history and the amount of people that we get for votes here in the server, there are enough people that show themselves up on the forums. It is just a question of caring. If someone really cares and values something he will do his part for something, if he doesn’t he won’t. That’s not the case here as much as it isn’t on GFL. So get rid of that opinion.

Second “point of view” you state is that people only would play for “wins”. You are again wrong. There are for sure those faggots that keep map fagging for their own sake like The Calculating God, which is the best example. But most of the people that are left are really good people in my eyes. They don’t just mapfag(If I see them I will fuck them up) because I will tell them even 100times if I have to that keeping up the variety will make them stay on this game mode and it won’t become boring. Many don’t even just play ze if you are aware of it. They gather themselves together to play some mg or bhop as well. Some zr or some gun game. They are really just enjoying their time together. Besides that I also see people in ze only joining from time to time to enjoy some hours with their friends, other than that I for myself also join sometimes just to keep up the contact to friends. There are times we talk and there are times we just play any map we usually didn’t. I can say that about myself as much as I can say that about Backy and many others. About door huggers, if you treat door huggers shit they will treat you shit which is logical sense. Some people are just too toxic to even consider talking to them but in my eyes there are a lot of people left, where you could simply ask them to stop which they would do. If someone would come to me and treat me like shit I would just keep door hugging. Why would I bother listening to that guy?

In i3d we tried to beat Paramina for months. We didn’t make it. Did we cry? No we didn’t, we felt sad at some point of course, but after all the teamwork we had together, those times we will never forget. We just tried together even if we didn’t have a good result. That is what it comes down to. So coming to your third “point of view” that people play only the same maps and get bored because there is not a leader, is also wrong. God gave you a beautiful voice gkou. He gave you a voice for a reason. If you feel like there isn’t any good leader, start using your voice. You guys became so lazy thinking that putting some “effort” into something, would be a pain. Without effort you don’t deserve a win. You should actually get also punished by making a mistake. Blue would say now it would result in “elitism”. That’s his point of view. My point of view of “elitism” is laziness. You guys just accept it that sitting on that “comfortable” chair you have built over the months/years that changes are not needed at all. People said the same about double ammo in Unloze. It got changed as well. Did it harm the server in any way? Everyone was feared they didn’t want to do it as well but at the end they got convinced it is way better without it.

Coming back to people that keep playing the same maps over and over again. Yes some still do, but it is not me. As long it is not me and I do my part telling people to not map fag it is fine for me. I can’t do more than that. It is up to every individual what the best is for him/her. Of course harder maps won’t be chosen, if there isn’t any good leader. Those maps are made large on purpose you know. Those maps need the full experience of teamwork or it won’t lead in any win. So do you really expect every day to have a good team that would just carry you through all maps possible? Keep dreaming of that because that will never happen and that shouldn’t be the case. Where would be the fun again just rushing through all maps?

It doesn’t matter which map you are playing. No matter old school or stage, this game mode is made for teamwork. You may think you guys aren’t “teamworking” on simple maps, but in fact you guys are. How else would you make it through the map without anyone just defending and running. Even on rooftop you guys do, there is a small chance to solo in every map almost, but yea at the end to make reach the end of a map, you guys work together as a team. If you decide at the end to let your mates down, just getting a screenshot for a solo, that is up to you.

Last thing you are saying is also something I would say sure. As long as I have the time for, I will keep leading, no matter which map it is. I want to give newer people the same chance, the chance to get in this game mode, to enjoy it and make the best out of it. I can lead 24/7; I don’t have a problem with that mate, but as long as I have the time for.

At the end, you basically just said what we all were talking here about. Kaczor made the point to enable failnades. Kaka came up with the idea to reduce some rebuys. I said that it should be done on certain maps. That’s what you said at the end as well. They were simply talking about minor changes that won’t harm anyone in any way. Just enjoy playing zombie escape and get rid of the opinion that some changes would result instantly in “destruction”.

 

[Kaczor]

In i3d we tried to beat Paramina for months. We didn’t make it. Did we cry? No we didn’t, we felt sad at some point of course, but after all the teamwork we had together, those times we will never forget. We just tried together even if we didn’t have a good result. That is what it comes down to. So coming to your third “point of view” that people play only the same maps and get bored because there is not a leader, is also wrong. God gave you a beautiful voice gkou. He gave you a voice for a reason. If you feel like there isn’t any good leader, start using your voice. You guys became so lazy thinking that putting some “effort” into something, would be a pain. Without effort you don’t deserve a win. You should actually get also punished by making a mistake. Blue would say now it would result in “elitism”. That’s his point of view. My point of view of “elitism” is laziness. You guys just accept it that sitting on that “comfortable” chair you have built over the months/years that changes are not needed at all. People said the same about double ammo in Unloze. It got changed as well. Did it harm the server in any way? Everyone was feared they didn’t want to do it as well but at the end they got convinced it is way better without it.

Thank you for taking effort into writing that post something I couldn't get myself to do well said