The 0 PING topic

FierceG Nov 19, 2019

  1. BadA

    BadA Active User

    36
    51
    243
    Ok i probably missunderstood your answer to phantom, but anyway i get what you say.
    If you're sure to let the 0 ping change honestly just close the thread. If not, maybe a vote as phantom proposed could be welcome.
     
  2. phantom

    phantom VIP VIP

    92
    300
    305
    yeah william you are right its all about my feelings. I never said i speak for everyone i simply said that there are people that don't like it and maybe its time for a vote to see where people stand.
     
    UZGANG and William! :D like this.
  3. Kaby

    Kaby KEK VIP

    126
    339
    365
    maybe we can get a vote about zammo aswell ? ;)
     
    UZGANG, Creepy, Bane and 1 other person like this.
  4. Malala

    Malala Active User

    43
    37
    148
    [​IMG]
     
    William! :D likes this.
  5. -Hudda

    -Hudda Meatropolian Admin

    89
    268
    360
    It's still a work in progress but is going to be our very own ff/laser ze training server.
     
  6. Neon

    Neon Pendulum SQ Senior Developer

    357
    1,056
    755
    So far I only seen ppl claim that it's "broken" or whatsoever their minds made up.
    It's not like suddenly everyone who used to win laser maps doesn't win anymore.
    But you see ppl with 250+ latency win maps that they probably had a really hard time winning before.
     
    Yash, gene, 1mpact and 2 others like this.
  7. William! :D

    William! :D Plumber in a world of perfect pipes Retired Admin VIP

    551
    1,790
    900
    Yes but let's make a deciding vote between 10-20 people because people *think* something and have an opinion and hence think they are in a position to decide. Let's ignore facts and proper arguments and people who benefit from this more than people who lose smth from this because they are used to lagged lasers.
     
  8. BotoX

    BotoX Active User Banned

    40
    103
    245

    Maybe this video helps with understanding why lag compensation is needed and wanted.
    And also why it can look really funny or broken from certain perspectives.
    Ignore the part about interpolation, that'd be too expensive for lasers.

    It works much better when there is only one player and the other object is stupid (like our laser).
    There is much more fun when two players have around 200ms+ latency between each other and are having a knife fight where a few ms count.
    Hence a lot of people also complain about katanas.
    It's just the physical constraints of the world we live in.
    Speed of light is too slow for doing real time stuff on our big internet.

    And idk about that bossfight on cosmo, could be the map too idk.
     
    Last edited: Dec 6, 2019
    UZGANG, William! :D, gene and 3 others like this.
  9. Klixus

    Klixus Active User Retired Admin

    35
    75
    300
    I didn't read what everyone else wrote, so i might be repeating someone. But a big issue for me as a player is that i have to adapt to 0-ping and non 0-ping servers. Previously every server had the same setup for lasurs, and the timing was easier to learn. Now i have to maintain two different timing setups, and that's..meh
     
    UZGANG likes this.
  10. 1mpact

    1mpact New User

    2
    10
    33
    Whilst I've played ze for a few years I'm very new to this server and community but was honestly drawn towards it by 0 ping.
    I'm from Australia and get 320 ping with my best VPN connection which isn't ideal and meant I usually avoided Unloze because I knew that every few maps there would be one involving lasers or some other sort of reaction-based boss that would be insanely hard to not die to. Thanks to this plugin I've been able to play on the server without the fear of "laser maps" ruining my experience although I'm still not a huge fan of them it's really satisfying to be able to have a fair chance at avoiding them.

    The argument of "new players can't dodge lasers anyway" is true I guess, but shouldn't they get all the help they can get whilst learning?

    To all the experienced players used to X ping and can easily beat every map, can't you welcome a challenge to try and adapt to having no lag?

    Whilst most players just focus on the lasers, the fact moving bosses now appear exactly as the server registers is also a huge help, with over 250 ping, trying to hit bosses that move isn't always as simple as aiming slightly in font of the boss and this plugin allows everyone to dodge and shoot said bosses without any lag issues.

    I've played csgo ze for thousands of hours with over 200 ping so I'm used to jumping early and I certainly jump way too early to the odd laser on Unloze but instead of blaming the plugin I blame myself and eventually I hope everyone will stop using 0 ping as their get out of jail free card when they die to lasers.

    The only improvement I hope could be implemented is Lag compensation for moving physics objects such as the falling shit on deadcore and the boxes on hsc but apart from that I really hope 0 ping stays on the server.
     
    UZGANG, Glacius, Yash and 7 others like this.
  11. bAka

    bAka i3d scripter Admin

    224
    437
    435
    Even if I don't really like this plugin, I will eventually like it because I just need to practice the timing of the lasers a bit, when they are basically in front of me, I jump, but for the next laser that may appear it will always be a little harder not to be killed. But I'm also sad, because this is getting 'trendy' this lasers thing, a bit sad how this gamemode will end (I don't know if I made myself understood).
     
  12. xen

    xen Senior Developer Senior Developer Mapper

    54
    108
    325
    Unfortunately this doesn't seem to be possible without breaking a lot in the process, if at all.
     
  13. gene

    gene Active User Retired Admin VIP

    25
    38
    205
    while the circumstances of the following example aren't completely identical, this is like if someone who autobhopped on csgo for years started complaining once valve made sv_autobunnyhopping 1 (client-side autobhop as opposed to server-side) and server owners enabled it for a better experience and throw a fit that they are used to playing a certain way so other people can't have an *objectively* better option
     
    UZGANG, Glacius, BotoX and 2 others like this.
  14. jenz

    jenz UNLOZE Founder Leader

    737
    2,019
    900
    i think botox should write a book on laser lag compensation
     
    UZGANG, Bane, Yash and 5 others like this.
  15. BadA

    BadA Active User

    36
    51
    243
    nah come on ppl doesnt read books anymore.... What about a movie ?
     
    Yash likes this.
  16. D()G@N

    D()[email protected] SoftServeMapsBestMaps Developer

    273
    528
    610
    UZGANG likes this.
  17. Tendub_

    Tendub_ Admin Admin

    45
    83
    298
    why can't phantom just have his vote? even if it won't change anything it would be nice to see where the server stands...

    personally ive had a lot of weird shit happen with 0 ping, but i haven't put much effort into figuring it out so im not very opinionated on the matter yet.


    telling people to go somewhere else to practice 0 ping is kind of lame, in principle. i suppose its a little better now that youre giving them a place to do so, but still. imo we should give people opportunities to get used to the new plugin on the main server. makov5 has the intermission voting round, maybe we could extend that round for a few minutes and just let people get some practice runs in?

    either way, theres got to be a more elegant solution than "lol deal with it" and forwarding people to practice servers and youtube video explanations...
     
    UZGANG likes this.
  18. gene

    gene Active User Retired Admin VIP

    25
    38
    205
    a vote would honestly be terrible because most people don't think rationally and will just think "i die so it's bad because this is about me"

    sure, that's a bit of an assumption from me, but i don't think it's an unreasonable one considering the opinions of people that are vocal about the plugin are 99% bad from what everyone sees. perhaps if some of the "silent lurkers" that don't mind/enjoy the plugin would speak up that would bring some perspective
     
  19. William! :D

    William! :D Plumber in a world of perfect pipes Retired Admin VIP

    551
    1,790
    900
    A vote would also not be a representation for the servers population. We're not trying to tell people to "deal with it". It's more about trying to fit a solution that fits everyone. The people complaining have it justified because they are not used to lasers adapted after them so it's a whole new thing they have to learn. But they don't seem to care about all the people who couldn't jump lasers at all before due to lag, but now can. Those people could not adapt, they can not do anything about their ping. But people with low ping can adapt to lag compensation. This is fair for everyone, even if it affects some people negatively.. for now.
     
    gene likes this.
  20. William! :D

    William! :D Plumber in a world of perfect pipes Retired Admin VIP

    551
    1,790
    900
    Voting about this would be selfish from both sides, people with high ping and people with normal/low ping.
     
-->